QuestionHello Roland, its me again. I purchased a new EGR valve and installed it. The car runs a little better but it is still missing. Should I change the plugs? Could I have fouled them out? Also, Are you suppose to reset the computer somehow so it will give you new codes for the problems now? Thanks again for all the help. Richard-------------------------
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-Roland, the car has a 3.3 liter Fuel Injected V6, before the car got to where it ran so bad its not drivable... the check engine light had been coming on but I ignored it forever. I was gonna try to fix this myself, in your opinion do you think I should just take it in to the shop or is possible for a rookie to fix?---------------
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Hello Roland, I did what you said and I'm pretty sure the code I got was 12 and 32. What do those codes mean? Thanks for all your help------------------
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I have a 94 Concorde, one other time I had a Oxygen sensor go out. I think it has happened again because of the way its running. I want to replace it myself but I dont know where exactly it is. Can you explain where on the motor its located? Thanks
Answer -
Hi Richard,
The sensor is located on the top side* of the exhaust manifold, on the rear side of the engine near the cabin. It is the only item that is attached to the manifold that has electrical connector wires. When removing and replacing it with a new one you need to be careful not to damage the tip of the sensor where the leads protrude. And you want to use some antiseize compound on the threads for later ease of removal. Now are you aware that it is likely that you can readout the memory of the engine controller and see if it has detected a problem with your present sensor? If you did this you could verify your suspicion.
Begin a readout as follows: Take your ignition key and turn the ignition switch "on-off-on-off-on" and leave it "on". Do this switching quickly so that no more than 5 seconds elapses. Then watch the 'check engine' light to begin to flash, pause, flash, pause, etc. Count the number of flashes before each pause and make a note of them in the order that they come. The last two flash groups will be 5 in each. Repeat the readout until you have the numbers accurately (the same result, two times in a row). Then pair the numbers two at a time in the order they came, to form two-digit numbers, for example the last number will be 55 which is the code for "end of readout". Then write back and tell me the other numbers that came out. The codes 21, 51, and 52 all relate to the O2 sensor, so any one of those would be relevant to your problem. But if you have other codes I would check into those before buying a new sensor.
Roland
If you have the 2.5L 4 cyl engine the sensor is on the side of the manifold rather than the top.
Answer -
Hi Richard,
The 12 means that sometime in the recent past (50-100 ignition key cycles) the battery was disconnected. Not a big deal unless you haven't done that in which case a clamp may be loose or corroded.
The 32 says that there is something wrong with the egr solenoid circuit or there is a failure in the egr system. The check engine light should be lit as the result of this code. Now I could be of more help if you would tell me which engine you have and whether it was a 49-state car or a california car, originally. But let me quote from the '96 Cirrus manual on this code:
"The Powertrain control module performs an on-board diagnostic check of the EGR system.
The Egr system consists of two main components: a vacuum solenoid and a vacuum operated valve with a back pressure transducer.The EGR monitor is used to test whether the EGR system is working within specifications. The diagnostic check activates only during selected engine/driving conditions. When the conditions are met, the EGR is turned off (solenoid enrgized) and the O2 sensor compenasaton control is monitored. Turning off the EGR shifts the air fuel ratio in the lean direction. The O2S sensor data should indicate an increase in the O2 concentration in the combustion chamber when the exhaust gases are no longer recirculated. While the test does not directly measure the operation of the EGR system, it can be inferred from the shift of the O2S sensor data whether the EGR system is operating correctly. Because the O2S sensor is being used, the O2S sensor test must pass its test before the EGR test."
So hare we have a complication, because you don't have an O2S failure code, but that sensor is involved in the EGR test. I don't know what to tell you. If you can tell me which engine you have I can probably tell you how to test the EGR system. And let me know if the check engine light is on, because it should be if the code is 32. If it isn't on, then re-read the codes.
Roland
Answer -
Hi Richard,
The egr system is pretty straightforward but you need a little written instructions to test it. On the California vs. 49 state I think that dichotomy vanished by '94 for this particular system (I was going by the '91 manual). So since you say that the light is "on" and you have a code 32, I believe you need to check the valve to see if it is moving open and closed (overserve the valve stem in the mushroom shaped cap region of the valve to see it go up and down as you rev the engine) and also check the vacuum lines and electrical connections to the valve and the transducer.
You may find a vacuum line is cracked, the electrical connector is open or the wires perhaps melted (insulation that is) or the valve itself is internally crudded up so as not to close when the car is idling as is should. I can xerox and snail mail you the pages from the '92 manual for the 3.3 to use as a guide. Just email me your mailing address to;
rfinston@hotmail.com
I will be unavailable on Saturday at the allexpert site, so write me back on Sunday there or email me directly if you want the pages. I would certainly look into the egr system as a source of bad running. It won't idle very well if the valve is stuch ajar, and may even die out.
Roland
AnswerHi Richard,
Certainly the plugs could be fouled up by a bad egr, so I would pull one and take a look. Also check over all the vacuum hoses for any cracks or disconnections. You might try pulling and replacing the spark plug cap for each cylinder (one at a time) while the engine is idling and look for a cylinder that when disconnected seems to not be causing a worsening of the misfire. That would be a cylinder to check for its plug, its wire, and maybe its compression.
To erase the fault codes, just turn on you headlights, disconnect the battery, turn off the headlight switch, let it stand for 5 minutes, then reconnect the battery. You should only have a 12 and a 55 at that point. Then run the engine for a while, even drive it, and see if anyother codes come out. The 12 will self-erase after 50-100 key on-off cycles.
