QuestionQUESTION: Hi Roland, I had to ask you a new question in order to get this to you. You have been trying to help me out with my 98 Concorde 3.2, I am not getting power to my fuel pump. I am getting I've at the #30 on my relay, I believe I found the plug under the dash (drk green and wht) no power to it, however theres a blk and purple wire into same plug that has power to it. I am getting spark at coils when cranking over. I do not know if relay is clicking for 1 second when I turn key to on, I can't hear it, and I do not believe it is. Electrical is not my thing at all, I am not getting very far I fear. I hope you have more ideas for me. thank you for everything thus far.
ANSWER: Hi Corey,
Here is the story: if you are getting spark then the sensors are fine, and the fuel pump relay should also close when you are cranking over the starter motor, if fuse 13 behind the dash is good (look carefully for a cracked wire, or better yet measure for continuity or for voltage across it when the key is in the 'run' position; any of these ways will verify that fuse). If you will recall in the past, when you first turned the key to 'run' you may have noticed a humming sound coming from behind you which is the sound of the fuel pump and it lasted for about 1 second. Then the relay opened. But it did close again when you put the key to the starter position, but you probably couldn't hear it then. In any case, you can either listen for the hum for 1 second, or measure for voltage at the fuel pump plug, or have a helper feel the relay when you turn the key to run to feel for the click, or measure at the plug under the dash (dark green/white wire, forget about the extra wire it is not involved), any of those would be a good test of whether or not the relay is closing. If it is not closing then I would have to believe the relay is faulty. Then you could find another relay in the box with the same part number but which isn't needed to run the engine, and switch out the fuel pump relay with that relay to see if that solves the problem.
If the relay is closing for 1 second, then you should also see 12V at the fuel pump plug for that same 1 second. If you aren't getting the fuel pump hum (or 12V at its plug) then either the fuel pump relay's internal points aren't conducting or the wire from the relay through the two plugs in the pathway to the fuel pump is interrupted.
I am not certain what #30 is on the relay socket, can you tell me which pin of the socket is #30? It may be the voltage from fuse G which is good, but it doesn't tell us whether the relay is passing that along when it closes.
So listen for the pump, get a helper to turn the key while you feel the relay, and if neither of those seem to be positive, then switch out the relay for a non-essential one and see if that solves the problem.
Roland
History:
'98 Concorde/LH: no power to fuel pump
Question: QUESTION: I have a 98 Concorde 3.2, the car was running fine, until I was leaving work. turned over but wouldn't start. I checked all fuses and relays, changed crank sensor, tested cam sensor, no codes except the p1684 and now the p0340. I thought it might have been security system problem, but that appears to be working. I checked wiring to the remote starter, which is t-ed into ignition,and disconnected it. Still no difference. My fuel pump is working. I am not getting power to my coils, or the 20amp fuse in dist. box. Could it be my ignition switch, or am I just missing something.
ANSWER: Hi Corey,
In what manner did you test the cam sensor? If you disconnect the battery, retry the start several times and then still get a cam fault code then I would believe it. Have you checked all three wires for continuity? black/light blue to pin 43, tan/yellow to 33 and orange to 44. Then measure for 8v on the orange, and between the other two wires while you turn the engine over by hand via the crank pulley bolt, and you should see a pulsation between 5 and 0.3V.
Roland
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QUESTION: checked and replaced cam sensor, thank you. However, I do believe I may have had a couple of issues, now that 1 is remedied, I now have now power to my fuel pump, the 10a fuse is good and has power, but I am not getting power to my fuel pump relay. Short in wiring somewhere?
ANSWER: Hi Corey,
Yes, the 10 amp fuse #13 in the behind the dash box controls the relay for the fuel pump but the actual power that the relay sends to the fuel pump comes from fuse G (40 amp) under the hood, in back row of fuses, the one closest to the outside (fender).
Roland
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QUESTION: I have power to my 10a fuse, 40a breaker, and relay, fuel pump does work, but I can not get a power signal to the plug under rear seat, the sending unit is working but I can't get power to the fuel pump, I checked ground wire under seat, and tried checking wiring as best as I can get to them, any ideas?
Answer: Hi Corey,
If you are certain that the fuel pump relay clicks "on" for about 1 second after you turn the ignition switch to the run position (but don't try to start the car?) and that you are getting 12V to the fuel pump relay socket on pin B (comes from fuse G 40 amp, which is not a 'breaker' according to the manual?), and that 12V is coming out of the relay on dark green/white wire at pin D of the relay (you might want to sneak a small wire into the relay socket's pins while the relay is installed to verify that you really are getting 12V out of the relay, which could have burned points inside of it for example); alzo are you aware that the fuel pump relay will NOT close and send along 12V when you are cranking it over UNLESS there is a valid signal coming out of the pcm which itself requires both the cam and crank sensor to be pulsing, this is a safety feature, the same thing applies to the spark coil; are you getting spark when you are cranking??):
then, the path of that voltage from the relay is next to a three pin plug/disconnect (located under the dash on top of a stack of plugs, the bottom which is the combination turn signal/hazard flasher which you can find audibly by turning on the flashers) and from there the dark green/white wire goes in a harness along the right side of the body under the door openings until it gets to a natural color 10-pin disconnect which is inboard and in front of the right rear wheel well (directly behind the rear seat area) at pin 7 of the 10 pins, and finally gets to the fuel pump plug on pin 4. The ground wire for the pump is on pin 2 of the plug and it goes through a splice and then to a ground point which is not shown in the manual. So just measure that pin to be sure it is shorted to ground.
That is the fuel pump circuit.
Please let me know what you learn.
Roland
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QUESTION: Hi Roland, I found a broken wire under my dist. box. fuel pump is working. So, I have fuel, spark to the coils but no spark to the spark plug, I put a plug to a bolt on engine to check for spark but nothing. According to my book, I can connect a LED test light to positive and connect lead to the grounding wire on coil, my book states only use LED or you could damage pcm, so I am unable to perform this test. But I have tested spark from each coil and I am not getting any, but I am getting power to the coils. I am still leaning to a bad PCM, do you think it's still to early to assume this?
AnswerHi Corey,
At the very beginning of this history you had spark, so what has changed? You changed the cam sensor, but did you test it for voltage pulsing afterwards, the way I described? If not, do that as it may not be good or possibly not installed properly.
What fault codes are you now showing on the PCM readout?
Why not get a simple 12V led and test the grounding circut of one of the spark coils to see if you are getting the pulsing signal from the pcm while a helper cranks it over, or you can turn it over by hand with the ignition in the 'on' position, the same as when you test the cam sensor for signal? So do those test and do a code readout. There are codes for a bad pcm by the way:0600, 1697 and 1698.
Roland
