QuestionQUESTION: I have a 1928 model a with a 1931 engine i need to flush the radiator very badly . I have looked in many books but i haven't found any information. I'm sure it should be pretty easy but I just don't want to mess it up .
ANSWER: Give me your e mail and I will send you an article I wrote on the A cooling system.
Don't need you address, I was able to paste it on this note.
Comments on the Model “A” Cooling System
All of us have had cooling problems with our cars, and there have been many attempts at fixes for the problem. I want to point out a few facts and thoughts at what we might consider as we approach the problem.
Basically, the A system is a pull (suck) through system. Not the best way to design a cooling system, but it will have to do. All systems have internal hot spots where the coolant flashes into steam. In most cases, it condenses back into a liquid as soon as it travels within the water jacket and hits some cooler water. This is normal. With a pull through system, if the radiator is plugged to some degree, and I think most are plugged, as the pump tries to pull the water out of the radiator, it results in a lower pressure within the engine and head. This is in the wrong direction. As the pressure decreases, so does the boiling point. I have not been able to measure this lower pressure. I have thoughts on how I might do it, but have not yet had the chance.
It has been said many times that the pump pumps more water than the radiator can handle. This is impossible. The pump gets all of its water from the bottom of the radiator. That is all it can pump. I do think the A pump is oversized for the job, so it is very aggressive in trying to get the water out of the engine. That’s why we have such a low pressure in the water jacket.
Many of us have cut down the size of the impeller on the pump. This is in the right direction since it reduces the size of the pump, and this reduces its ability to draw that low pressure in the engine. Just doing that has “fixed” many systems.
What I think happens within the engine when we are going about 45 mph on a warm day is the following: The radiator is plugged to some degree. The pump works hard and lowers the boiling point to where the hot spots within the engine flash large amounts of water into steam creating a large bubble. When this happens, the pump is free to pump the water that is down stream of this bubble, out of the engine. The bubble simply expands to fill the void. At this point, the pump is pumping more water than the radiator can handle. The pump is pulling on that bubble and trying to pump all of the water out of the engine, independent of what is coming through the radiator. When this happens, it causes the water to escape out of the overflow tube and anywhere else it can get out. This progresses until you are making a lot of steam in the engine and it all goes down hill from there. If you check early enough, you will see the familiar foam in the top of the radiator. This is caused by the big bubble of steam and water (antifreeze) being whipped into a foam by the pump.
How to fix all of this is simple. Get the radiator unplugged. The lower the restriction of the radiator, the less affect the pump will have on creating the low pressure within the engine.
Our current new radiators that we buy have the small more efficient tubes in them. When they re-core a radiator, they do it with those very small tubes. The old A radiator had the big tubes that let the junk flow through.
I put a new radiator on my car, and after a few miles, it plugged. I paid $400 for a filter.
The old trick of filling up a radiator with water and letting it flow out does not tell you if the tubes are clear. This is a very poor measure of how open the tubes are. I have been working on a method to “flow “a radiator, but I have not perfected it yet. A full flowing radiator needs a large water supply to keep things at a steady state while you measure the flow. I can come close, but can only measure a radiator that is partially plugged.
What we need is someone to re-core our radiators with a large tube core.
If you think you have a plugged radiator, or someone in your club does, try to hook up a clear vinyl tube to the drain petcock, or a fitting in that same area, and run the tube up outside of the hood, above the top of the radiator, and where you can see it. Have someone hold it there while you run the engine at an rpm that equates to 45 mph. With the engine off, the water level in the tube is the same as the level in the top tank. With the engine running at 45 mph, I predict that the level in the tube will surprise you. I have not been able to do this, but I think the level in the tube will go so low that it might even suck air into the petcock. I would then like to do this same set up on a car that does not overheat, and compare the results.
If you can find the time and energy to do this, please let me know.
Jack Bahm
Oakleaf Region
jackbahmlll@yahoo.com
The bottom line is that your rad. is plugged and you won't be able to get someone to rod it out. I have never seen back flushing do any good at all. Some even boil them out, but they must be rodded out. Look for an old time rad shop and talk to them. The problem is, when they take off the top tank, it all comes apart.
When you think you have it fixed, then drive at 45 mph for 10 minutes. If it is clear, it will not boil over.
Good luck, and let me know how you make out.
jack
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QUESTION: ok thats all good but i know they system hasn't been flushed in about 3yrs at least ..whats the mix of antifreeze to water with this older car. the radiator doesn't seem to be clogged i would just like to flush and maintain it.
AnswerIt's best if the rad if off the car and upside down, but that is a lot of work. On the car, remove both hoses and try to run water up from the rad outlet and out the top (inlet). To degrease it, put cascade dish washer det. in it and run it for a day or two. (about a 1/2 cup would do, then fill with water) Then flush it all out. When you get the water running clean, then cut the prestone 50/50 with water and use that. A lot of guys do not run anti freeze in the summer, but I do. It has a higher boiling point. I don't think there is anything agressive enough on the market that you can flush with. Go see what they have and you might give it a flush. It won't hurt anything, but the epa has shut down the agressive stuff. I change my antifreeze after about 3 years. Hope some of this helps.
Good luck.
jack
