QuestionQUESTION: Friday I noticed my car turn over very slightly slower than usual, most would have not noticed. Next start was on Sunday, slower turn over, most would have noticed. Monday morning just about turned over a couple of times but not fast enough to start, following this all it was doing was making a fast clicking noise (I THINK? its a solonoid rather than the starter motor making said noise). I charged the battery for 3.5 hours, was then fine on Tuesday. The same day I took it to Halfords, the battery is fine. By wednesday morning the problem is as per Monday. However a chap at work lent me his meater, its charging at 14V, so I checked to see if anything was draining it fuse by fuse; 1.5A drain on auxillary fuse (radio etc). this fuse is now removed however despite 4 * 18 mile trips the problem persists. Thoughtfull opinions welcome.
ANSWER: Hi Paul,
14v charge rate is ok if it is constant. With the radio fuse out, pull one battery cable off with everything turned off and put a 12v test light between the cable and the battery post to see if there is any other draw. If none, have the battery load tested. Many parts stores will do it free. Even if the battery is new do it anyway. With the problem you are having you can't leave any stone unturned. Is this a generator car or alternator? If it is a generator sometimes the regulator main contacts can stick closed after you turn the engine off. If it is alternator the large brown wire on the alternator can run the battery down if you have a leaking diode pack. The 12v test light test will tell that.
You may have to clean all main cable connections including the ground strap from engine to frame.
A last resort would be to connect a volt meter to any of the brown wires under the dash and to ground and leave it on while you drive so you can monitor charge rate as you drive. No good battery will go down with a 14v charge on it.
It is either a bad battery, a loss of the 14v charge rate when driving or it is a draw on the battery when shut down. All three can be tested as I described above.
Let me know,
Howard
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QUESTION: Hello Howard. Today tested current the alternator was providing, despite 14V it is only providing 1A. Ive done all the rest as perscribed by yourself, none showing any problems and given before I recharged the battery, ie. when it was flat it started with no problem using jump leads Ive ordered a recon alternator. £47 and a little work beets taking it to a garage. Thanks for your help.
ANSWER: Amperage is 100% dependent on the load not the force behind it. Voltage is the force behind it (the alternator)
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QUESTION: Nightmare! In my first question you will note I took it to Halfords to have the battery tested. Muppets! I asked if he had load tested it, he said yes and in adition to stating that it was at 12.something V, he added that the it was over 75% charged which I took him as saying in the context of assuring me that the load test had passed and that the battery was at sufficient charge to get accurate readings. However looking back I can only think all he tested was % charge and Voltage.
Anyway you will note in question 2 that advice was given to me from 2 qualified electricians! However Howard, I still listened to the advice you gave in reply to my second message and went looking on the net to boost my knowledge on batteries when I hit upon it. When I was running a test on the battery when it had gone flat again it was giving 10.something volts, so when I saw an article explaining about two cells joining giving such a reading I thought, too much of a coincidence to be ignored. So off to a different Halfords after charging the battery again, which I must add as you know its very relevent, took very little time! This time Im running the test!!! ;-)
I ask the young man, what voltage is it giving, the answer returns, 12.something V. I asked him what % the battery was charged to and the reply came that it was fine. I then asked for a load test and he looked blank. At this point I realised that they arnt trained to load test and really know nothing at Halfords in general. He offered to do an alternator check, but it turned over a little before dying, it didnt start. The young man looks puzzled and goes inside for help. At which point some one with experience comes out.... and confirms what I am sure you know and I now have some idea on, a couple of the cells were joined by firing (call it what you like) so the tests were false as they were based on surface charge and more over usless as no load test was carried out.
So there you have it, the battery was the problem. Lets see what return policy they have on that alternator I have but dont need!
Isnt it amazing that 4 supposidly qualified people can provide such usless assessments. Well done to you! Thank you.
AnswerYes, Paul the auto industry as a whole has a problem and it is hard to fine people who know what they are doing. Over the years I worked in many dealerships and independent shops and I came to a conclusion that when a customer takes a car into most shops for a problem, they have about a 50% chance of getting the car fixed with ONLY what is needed.
Even though most shops may have a 90%+ rating of fixing a car, There are often parts installed that were not needed.
In many dealerships if a mechanic installs an electrical part and it don't fix the problem he can NOT return it to his own parts dept. (Most auto parts stores will not accept an electrical part back for any reason) Lots of luck on your alternator return. If they take it back you are way ahead of the game.
A part of the overall problem is the manufacture who will not allow any dealership to make component repairers under warranty so many mechanics end up as parts replacers via a scanner result. If a scanner told the mechanic to replace a part and it didn't fix the car, many mechanics today have no clue what is wrong or how to fix it. Too many just keep putting parts on until it is fixed. If the customer is lucky, there may be one or two skilled mechanics in that shop that can advise the first mechanic as to how to test the car without the use of the scanner. I don't mean to knock the scanner test system as most of the time it may be correct.
But, if you want a comparison to another industry, look at doctors, I came to the same conclusion with them. You have about a 50% chance of getting fixed on the first visit. The standard statement is "Try this and if it don't work come back and we will try something else". Their over all rating may be 90%+ of a final repair. Just like the car industry.
Howard
