QuestionQUESTION: Hello Brian. First off, thanks for being so helpful with everyone; its nice to have a resource like you to consult. I have a question that I have not found much help searching online for, so I'm hoping to lend help to other new TL owners out there. Just so you know, I am a very good with wiring/circuitry, so please be as specific as you would like in your responses.
Basically, I am looking to add a 600W ~ 1000W amp/subwoofer package to my 2010 Acura TL w/ Tech Package. The factory audio sounds decent, but has far too little Bass and I am eager to upgrade quickly, but need to make sure the wiring and other mods I do do not negatively affect the car in any way.
I would like to disconnect the current factory amp and sub and add a new amp and (2) sub box. However, I do not want to over-draw the car in any way, so feel free to add capacitors to your response. Money is of course an issue, but I'll be happy to spend as much money to upgrade the bass stably. Here are my questions/concerns:
1. Do you know where the amp for the sub is located in the car, and/or how to access it? I cannot find a concise answer anywhere.
2. Can I bypass the factory amp/sub but still use the Subwoofer control in the Nav Screen to control the intensity of the new sub package?
3. Is there a way to use the existing pre-amp (line-level) audio signal from the factory amp an the input to the new amp WITHout an LOC? Can the LOC cause impedance or other issues that over time may harm the advanced audio system? (I worry about long term resistance issues...)
4. If I use a competition-level equipment (JL ~1000W w/ appropriate subs) what will I need to do to the vehicle to compensate for the high draw? An expensive capacitor to protect the alternator?
Thanks again for your help and feel free to elaborate. This will surely be a concise guide for other TL owners once we address all concerns. Thanks you VERY much!
Chad
4.
ANSWER: Hi Chad,
I apologize for the extreme delay in answering this question. I'm afraid you caught me at a bad time.
I appreciate your confidence in me, but I have to admit that I haven't had the opportunity to work on a newer TL with the ELS audio system, and I don't have a lot of information on it. I'll try to answer your question based on what I do know.
There's no separate amplifier for the subwoofer in your vehicle; all the speakers are driven by a single multi-channel amplifier located in the trunk, under the liner on one side (sorry, I'm not sure whether it's on the driver or passenger side).
I think your best option is to use a line output converter on the amplifier's subwoofer output, rather than trying to adapt the low-level input to an after-market amplifier. I wasn't able to find any information about the type of audio signal used between the TL's factory head unit and amplifier. There's a possibility that it's a type that wouldn't adapt well to the after-market amp's RCA inputs, such as a fixed-level output or a digital signal. Both of these are becoming increasingly common in OEM premium audio systems (though I haven't yet seen them in Honda/Acura systems). Using a high quality line output converter with the amp's subwoofer output, you can be pretty certain of getting an audio signal that should work well with any after-market amplifier. Any head unit adjustment that would have affected the stock subwoofer will affect the line output converter as well, so you can use the factory subwoofer controls to adjust your after-market system.
I've never seen any impedance-related problems in using a line output converter with a factory audio system. In most cases, the LOC is wired in parallel with an existing factory speaker, which usually runs between 2-8 ohms. A LOC's input impedance is deliberately designed to be very high, so that the change in the overall impedance load isn't significant. In your case, though, you'll probably be disconnecting the factory subwoofer and running the factory amp's output to the line output converter alone. In this case, there would be a big change in the system's load impedance, but I wouldn't expect this to result in any problems. Keep in mind that a higher load impedance actually reduces the strain on the amplifier, because it reduces the output current, so that the amplifier will generate less heat. This is more likely to increase the amplifier's working life rather than reduce it.
I wouldn't recommend a capacitor for your system, because I don't believe it will reduce the strain on the vehicle's charging system, and I'm doubtful that it will produce any noticeable change in sound quality or output level in a subwoofer system. No matter how big a capacitor you use, every bit of electrical power consumed by your audio system must ultimately be generated by the alternator. If your alternator cannot keep up with the current demand, then neither a capacitor nor an extra battery will help the situation. The most useful upgrade, short of a high-output alternator, would probably be an improvement of the factory charging system wiring; ie, the wires between the alternator output and battery, the vehicle chassis and the battery, and the chassis and engine block.
Hope this helps!
Brian
---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------
QUESTION: Thanks for all of the info Brian. Honestly, thank you for being so descriptive. I’m a tax accountant (surprisingly, haha) so feel free to ask my any Q’s that you may have. Again, I really appreciate you going out of your way for everyone.
I’m glad to hear that I can stably use a LOC in the trunk and not have to mess with the factory system too much. I do have one follow-up Q relating to protecting the electrical system. I had already bought a capacitor (I bought a 10 Farad Boss Audio Cap for $68) I do not mind using it even if I’m not going to get full benefit from it (I just want to make sure that a poorly made cap can’t cause more problems than solutions.)
My question is, if I do replace the “Big 3” as you suggested, is there a different or specific type of capacitor that you recommend, even if its overkill? There are so many types of caps out there, I got confused. This is my 4th car and also my 4th personal bass install, but this will be my first >1000W amp, first dual-coil subs, and first cap. Have you used the Boss CAP10’s before? I can buy a different one if the Boss caps are garbage. I’m just new to caps and haven’t found any info online as to what types of caps to use in different situations. Thanks again!
AnswerHi Chad,
Sorry again about the delay.
I don't think you'll hurt anything by using the capacitor if you wish. I'm doubtful that it will make a significant difference in your system, but even a cheap one shouldn't do any harm. I haven't personally used a lot of capacitors, and I can't really recommend any particular type or brand name.
When I say that I doubt that a capacitor will make a difference in your system, I'm talking about an "audible" difference, not a "measurable" difference. The value of a capacitor is the fact that it can store a charge at the alternator's output voltage, and if there's a voltage drop in the system, then the capacitor can start supplying current immediately. That's not like a second battery, which won't produce any output current until the system voltage drops below 12.8 volts or so. On the other hand, the amount of energy that can be stored by a capacitor--even a large one--is very limited compared to a battery, which means that a capacitor can only deliver current for a very short period of time.
The purpose of a capacitor isn't to reduce the strain on the vehicle's charging system, but to help maintain a stable voltage for the amplifier's power supply. This may increase the "headroom" of an amplifier's output. In other words, if there's a sudden, brief increase in the output signal--a musical transient peak--then the extra power that can be quickly delivered by the capacitor may help keep the amplifier from clipping. So the addition of a capacitor might improve the audio system's sound quality when it's used with a full-range amplifier, playing some types of music. With a subwoofer amplifier, it's much more difficult to hear the effects of clipping, and the periods requiring extra power tend to last longer. That makes a capacitor less useful for a subwoofer amplifier than a full-range amplifier. Additionally, capacitors with more storage capacity also tend to have a higher internal resistance. That means that if the capacitor needs to deliver a lot of current, there will be a certain amount of built-in voltage drop within the capacitor itself.
In general, while you might be able to measure a difference in the amplifier's supply voltage when you're using a capacitor, I don't believe it will make enough of a difference to be audible in a typical subwoofer system. To be honest, I'm not aware of any independent tests that show a capacitor making an audible difference in any type of sound system.
A capacitor is a very efficient device, and it's not likely to make your vehicle's alternator or charging system work any harder. It certainly won't hurt to install it, so if you have one already, there's no reason not to put it in. I don't believe it will help you system noticeably, but I don't believe it will do any harm either.
Hope this helps!
Brian
