QuestionQUESTION:
I asked this question yesterday and you refered me to your bypass webpage...
"i am a mechanic working on a 1997 deville. it wont start, and when it does it only runs for a second. i have checked the fuel pressure and pressure regulator. it gets good spark, and runs when i pour fuel in the intake air tube to the filter. i also put oil in it to the full marker. it was very low and i didn't know if it had a float shut-off in the pan. it has an aftermarket alarm on it, and it seems to work right. on the dash display when i booger with the reset and mode buttons i am getting from the run position a readout saying..."security system malfunction. engine may not restart. i have the original ignition key with the chip in it. the door key i am not sure is original. it doesn't have a chip in it. i have shut all doors, trunk, and hood and made sure the push switches in door hood ect. are working. or they seem to be. i did not probe them with a meter. anyways after closing everything including the windows, i locked and unlocked the driver door with key, and did the same with the passenger door. i spoke with the Cadillac dealer, and they said it "sounded like" it was the ignition tumbler switch set.and most likely is not a bad key. can you please look into my problem. thank you,
Dan"
MY NEW QUESTION IS... on your webpage for that bypass module it says if i want to just permenantly disable the pas key system i can ground the imput wire.. is the wire in question connected to the lock tumbler itself.. or is it in the wiring harness somewhere. can u briefly describe the process if i can do it this way without buying the bypass module.. it is a customer car and we have been trying to get this str8 for some time now.. hee is beginning to doubt my mechanical expertees. u know how it is.. they act like i know every little thing about every year make and model. we all know that is completely impossible.. thanks for responding so fast.. dan.. ps i an just kinda waitin for your reply today if possible thx..
ANSWER: Hi,
Just by your description, I can tell you the problem you have is not in the VATS. You said that the engine will start and won't run long. The VATS is starter based and the engine will not crank at all if malfunctioning.
The dealer is wrong. The common problem with these is that the two small wires leading from the column will break and cause a no start at times. This system will not cause the engine to stall!
You may have indicators that there is a problem in the VATS, which means you have more than one problem..
You need to fix the running problem before you fix anything to do with the so-called anti-theft problem.
By design, the VATS does not shut off fuel once the engine is running. This could create a liability on the part of the manufacturer.
Rob
---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------
QUESTION: i was reading the webpage that u sent me to about that bypass module.. and it said if i wanted to permanentally dissable it i can just ground one of the wires going to the ignician tumbler switch set. can u confirm this for me and possibly explain what wire it is exactly.. meaning if i probe the wire is it always grounded or does it just ground when in the start, and run position.. ect. thx u have been a great help so far...
AnswerHi,
It was not my webpage http://www.autotheftexpert.com that you saw something about a bypass module or grounding anything.
As I stated, your description confirms that your running problem is NOT a VATS problem. Not if it stays running when you are pouring fuel into the intake.
The engine will not even crank when the problem is with the anti-theft system.
The first place to blame is the anti theft system. This is because very few understand how they work.
I found it quite common for my techs, when working as a service manager at a dealer, the problem no matter what it was had to be in the after market stereo or alarm.
Now, I will help you out here, but you are barking up the wrong tree.
There is no such thing as a tumbler in a vehicle ignition lock. This terminology is because of TV. You have an ignition lock cylinder assembly and what are called tumblers are actually flat and known as wafers. The wafers fit into a lock plug with a pick resistant side bar. The Lock assembly in your car is known as a GM 10-cut. There are 10 cuts on the key and 9 wafers. Made in half cuts, these locks are very sloppy and a number of keys can fit these locks. Over time due to wear even more keys will operate the lock. The ignition lock assembly and keys are made by Strattec of Milwaukee, WI for GM.
You will find that the VATS key is longer than the average key. The reason is because the resistor chip (wrongly termed computer chip)has to make contact with two contacts in the front of the lock and two wires that run down through the steering column. These wires are very small (Like phone wires) with white insulation and an orange sheath that lead to the bulkhead in the firewall on the left side of the dash. These wires then go to the VATS decoder mofule which reads the resistance of the key that enables the engine to crank and start.
The most common problem with this system is that the wires would break inside the insulation at cause a no start at times situation.
The easiest way of bypassing it is by going to an alarm store and getting a VATS bypass kit (included in every alarm w/remote start) of 14 resistors. Measure the resistance in the key. cut the white wires from the ignition lock under the dash and install the correct resistor bypassing the system all together.
The problem you will run into though: If the car is stolen and you file a claim, the insurance company will deny your claim because the cxar is allegedly unstealable according to them and their so-called experts.
In Cleveland and Detroit, I have actually seen insureds charged with filing a false police report and insurance fraud on VATS equipped vehicles due to ignorrance on the part of insurance companies, experts and prosecutors. In fact, I have been involved as the defense expert in many of these case where my client was exonnerated once I showed what a fraud this system was.
Even it's terminology VATS (Vehicle Anti-Theft System) is a flat out lie. It does not prevent theft!!!!!!
Well, I hope I assisted you. If I were you though, I would be looking elsewhere because the problem does not sound like a GM VATS problem.
Good Luck!!!
Rob
