QuestionQUESTION: Hi Kevin,
My car:
1999 Chrysler Cirrus 2.5 engine 6 cyl (90,000 miles)
I've read plenty about the same problems others were having with their same model year, and thought I had it figured out that it was a PCM issue. Well, I still think I was close but maybe something to do with the communications to and from the PCM.
I live in Florida where it has been very hot and humid this summer. I would be driving for a while and without warning, the engine would cut-out(or stall.) I noticed that it was happening between 35-45mph each time. I could go days without a problem, and then it would just happen again without warning. The pattern seemed to be just after it rained, or if it sat in the sun for a long period of time. Early mornings and late evenings seemed to run best. While idling at a light a red lamp (looks like a red genie bottle) would flicker and it would feel like it was going to stall, but doesn't. So, I self diagnosed this as a bad PCM. I just had a re-manufactured one installed that was programmed for my VIN and part number. Car ran great for the day. In fact, it seemed to shift and idle much better.
Now the new problem just one day later. I go out in the morning and start the car (in garage all night.) 5-10 seconds in it stalls. Starts right back up no problem, but stalls again in same time-frame. This is a new problem since one thing that was reliable before is that the car would always start and run fine (for a while.)
I start it up again and rev the engine and leave. I drive approximately 7 miles and come to several stops with no problem. Then I stop again at a stop sign and it stalls. It starts right back up no problem. Drive another couple of miles no problem. I go back home no problem. Car has been sitting in the garage for about 8 hours. I start the car no problem, but again stalls in 5-10 seconds.
At start RPM's go to about 1,000 and then settles somewhere around 750. I turn the A/C on and the RPM's go up to 1,000. No engine lights or codes.
I had the car in the shop back in March and had a fuel service done. Not because I was having problems, but because my Chrysler dealership recommended it. Service records show that they serviced the fuel inj, throttle body, inspected fuel system hoses and lines for leaks. I didn't start experiencing this stalling problem until about 3 months later.
I'm just very confused that it seems to have created new problems that were not there before. Still stalling but in different scenarios.
Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
ANSWER: Hi Brad,
There is one possible specific cause that resulted in a Technical Service Bulletin for this engine in the relevant time frame that includes your car: replace the egr valve. This is something you can do yourself.
"NUMBER: 18-020-01
GROUP: Vehicle
Performance
DATE: Aug. 17, 2001
SUBJECT:
Rough Idle, Hard Start, Start & Stall
OVERVIEW:
This bulletin involves installing a revised EGR valve.
MODELS:
1995 - 2000 (JA) Breeze/Cirrus/Stratus
1996 - 2000 (JX) Sebring Convertible
NOTE: THIS BULLETIN APPLIES TO VEHICLES EQUIPPED WITH A 2.5L ENGINE.
SYMPTOM/CONDITION:
Vehicle may intermittently exhibit any of the following conditions:
• Rough engine idle.
• Hard start or long crank after hot soak.
• Start and stall when started with cold engine.
• Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) P0300, Multiple Cylinder Mis-fire.
04287646AC Valve, EGR"
The exhaust gas recirc valve system is something I would certainly recommend that you check, as if the valve sticks ajar it will definitely cause misfiring.
I suggest that you either change the valve as per the TSB (above) or lube the old valve stem with WD-40 and move it back and forth with the tip of a screwdriver in the slot on the stem to be sure it is moving to a dead-stop via internal spring-action). It is located at the rear of the engine in a small pipe which branches off the front exhaust manifold.
Roland
PS Sorry for the delay in responding but your question only appeared in the 'pool' today when Kevin sent it there.
.
---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------
QUESTION: Hi Roland,
Actually, that was a very quick response. Thank you for that.
Just one more quick question/comment. After writing this, I took the car out and not only do I have this new problem, but the "old" problem re-appeared.
It was mid-day and very hot/humid. Car stalled at around 35/mph. Wouldn't restart for about 5-10 minutes of sitting. Do you think the EGR could be the cause of this also, or do I have multiple issues?
Thanks again for your expertise!
Brad
AnswerHi Brad,
Try lubing the egr valve stem and 'work' it, and see if that corrects things. If not, then I would suggest that you put some pins through the insulation of the cam and crank sensor wires (black/light blue grounds, tan/yellow cam sensor signal, gray/black crank sensor signal). Then carry along a voltmeter and when it stalls immediately check the for the voltage across the sensors. Leave the ignition in the run position, have a socket and wrench so you can turn the engine over by hand via the crank pulley bolt. It the sensor is good, the voltage should pulse betweeen 5V and 0.3V as you turn it by hand. If not, then that sensor is failing when it gets warmed, then recovers when it cools. Ideally you would get a fault code too. But in the marginal function it might not yet set a code.
Roland
