Chrysler Repair: Neon SE 2005 code p0507, 0508, 0340, dodge neon 2005, camshaft position

Question
QUESTION: Helly Kevin,

I recently purchased a Dodge Neon 2005 SE car. It was a used car and for the first days I was driving it just fine, but then some problems appeared.

I did the on board check (three times switch on) and the computer listed the following codes:
P0507, P0508 and P0340.

I already read that 0507 and 0508 are codes for idle high speed, wich I do have but only when I set the car on neutral; I also know that P0340 is about the camshaft position circuit and have asked where and how to test it.

I also noticed this behaviour of the car:
The car vibrates (mostly like a massage machine) a lot, simetimes it is quite intense. This vibration may increase and decrease just because, being the car idle or roading.
The vibration seems to be related to the car's performance. When the vibration is high, the engine is quite noisy (the noise is like thay of a remote control toy car), acceleration is very slow and the driving of the car feels loose.
When the vibration reduces (almost to null), the engine is no longer noisy (just the normal), acceleration is great and the car feels solid.

When going up-hill, specially when the car is noisy and feeling loose, the engine loses power and I have to take it to the 1st or 2nd gear, the 3rd may go up but very slowly and 4th and 5th are just lost cases.

The engine compression has been tested and proved right. The throttle body has been cleaned. Spark plugs cables have been recently replaced (a month ago, tops) and the battery is also new.

Also, while driving, the car just won't accelerate and go beyond 2000rpm, this has happened three times. If I am driving about 65 m/h it just drops to less than 20 and won't go up anymore regardless of the gear I am using. This happens while roading or in idle. A quick turning it off and on again has solved the problem.

Yesterday, I parked the car facing up-hill for a couple of hours. Temperature lowered and when I tried to start the car, it didn't. I had to push it and start it on 2nd gear. This has been the 2nd time that has happened exactly the same, parking it facing up-hill and low temperature. While trying to start it, I verified that it did tried to start but seemed to not getting enough fuel to complete the process. I even tried to start it pushing the accelerator with no success.

After this hard ignition time, I had this problem of the 2000rpm limit.

I have taken the car to a couple of workshops but no-one seems to get the right answer.

Could you help me with this? thanks a lot for your time and attention. Have a nice day

ANSWER: Kevin passed your question to the 'pool', which means back to me, Roland. Did you see the revision, I sent you, of your earlier question? I sent it yesterday.

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Oh Thanks again Mr. Roland,

I did try to ask a follow up question but the system displayed a reading saying that you were on vacation and later on another message saying that for some reason (perhaps the hour, it was late at night) you couldn't answer.

I wanted to add the other problems I had to my follow up question, just to find out if I had to check something else, most of all because I had this issue of the car not accelerating and the limit of 2000 rpm.

To check the camshaft position wiring and sensor, do I have to start the car or just switch it on? For testing the wiring, do I have to unplugged it or do it while plugged?

Thanks a lot againg Mr. Roland

Answer
Hi Ivan,
To check the wiring between the sensor and the pcm you don't have the ignition on but you do have to unplug the sensor and the plug at the pcm. Check for continuity of the 3 wires using an ohmmeter or continuity testor between the sensor socket and the pcm pin it is connected to (which I listed earlier in the history, see below).
To check the function of the sensor, you need to have the ignition switch in the run position, and then with everything hooked up again use fine pins to pierce through the insulation of the three wires. Check that you have the voltage on the voltage supply wire. Then using a wrench on the crankshaft pulley bolt to turn the engine by hand, measure the voltage between the other two wires which you should see to oscillate between 5 and 0.3V several times per each revolution of the crankshaft.
Roland
PS:Sorry to not be always available, I take questions one at a time, and don't want to build up a log of unanswered question. That is how I can get back to you quickly when I am available.
Please 'rate' my answer, again, and conside a nomination if you would be so kind. Thanks


Earlier History:

Hello Mr. Roland,

Thanks a lot for helping us people new to cars. I have a Dodge Neon 2005 SE. I'm sorry if this issue has been addressed before, I did look up and found nothing.

I bought this car from another person just a few months ago, so I have very little knowledge of what maintenance work it has had.

My car shivers when in idle most of the time, sometimes it is quite intense, but from time to time, while roading, something just "fits" and it suddenly stops shivering.

Another aspect about this shivering is that the engine is also quite noisy when this happens. When it stops shivering the engine does the "normal" noise. This noise is also acompanied by a lack of power of the engine, it suddenly suffers to accelerate. This shivering feels like the one you feel in a massage chair.

I did the OBD check (the one you get when openning the switch 3 times without starting the car) and I got this codes:
P0507
P0508
P0340

I read that both P0507 and P0508 are related to the idle speed, which I do have high, and that P0340 is about camshaft position sensor.

I have read also that I have to check the wiring and sensors. Is this something I can do myself?

Could this be the reason for the car shivering and lose of power?

Thanks a lot and have a nice day
Answer: Hi Ivan,
The 0340 probably is what is causing the shivers... what I suspect others would call a 'miss' meaning poor firing of one or more cylinders. It says that the signal from the camshaft position sensor is not getting to the engine computer reliably. There are 3 wires on that sensor and its connections are as follows, all going to the orange multi-wire plug at the combined engine/transmission controller: the sensor ground wire is black/light green and goes to pin 27, the sensor signal wire is tan/yellow and goes to pin 34, and the 5 volt supply wire is orange and goes to pin 29. You could verify the continuity of the wires between the sensor connector and the plug using a ohm meter or continuity tester. If those prove out, then replacing the sensor would be wise. Please tell me which size engine you have (L) and I can tell you specifically about where to find it and hot to replace it.
The other two codes are saying the the engine controller can't get the idle speed correctly set (which also is probably due to the 'miss') so see if those go away after the sensor is replaced. If not, then remove the idle speed motor at the throttle body and clean its tip and the air side passage for the idle air intake on the side of the throttle body's throat.
There are 4 multiwire plugs on the combined controller and it is located near the battery and power box.


Ivan responded:
I changed both cam/crank sensors car wont start and car still shows p0340 code. Theres spark,gas,battery working properly ect. anything please?


Hi Ivan,
Did you erase the codes by disconnecting the battery for a minute, and then when you checked were all the codes gone(except 1684)? If not, then you may just have a 'stale' 0340.
Then did you try to start the engine and then did you find the new 0340 code? If that is the case, then indeed you aren't getting cam sensor signal pulsing to the powertrain controller.
In my first answer I listed the colors and coneections of the three wires on the cam sensor. Did you verify that those wires are connected between the cam sensor plug and the powertrain controller, as I described?
If so, then check that you have 5 volts on the 5 volt wire when the key is in the run position. Then using a couple of straight pins probe thru the insulation of the other 2 wires and measure for voltage pulses to be present when you turn the engine over by hand using a wrench on the crank pulley and with the ignition key in the run position. You should see pulsing between 0.3v and 5v several times per revolution of the crankshaft if the sensor is putting out a signal. If it isn't then reposition the sensor so that its tip is in contact with the surface of the metal that is 'senses' and lock it in that position. Then see if you get signal or not.
Let me know what you find, and if that doesn't fix it we'll go from there. But verify the codes, and tell me which size engine you have.
Roland
PS Please 'rate' my answer, and also consider giving me a nomination to be 'expert of the month'. Thnaks