QuestionHi again,
Thank you so much for your help so far...it is truly appreciated. Doing this myself I sometimes wonder if people on the other side appreciate it...well I am today on the other side, I can say I really do!
I did what you said although not sure if the first quick flash counts it would either be codes 12-24-55 (or 22-4-55). Looking at the web site you gave me, and assuming the computer spits them out in order, I am assuming it is the first set of numbers since 4 does not seem to exist either.
12 (Battery or computer recently disconnected); would make sense, I disconected the battery when changing the thermostat and again today when changing the Coolant sensor switch, which I figured could not hurt to change.
24 (Throttle position sensor over 4.96V (SEE NOTE #3)); well that would make sense as well and pretty clear cut, I guess I have to change this? Now if this fixes the idling, which is problematic only when in park or neutral, otherwise stable, could it affect in any way the heating up of the vehicle?
As for the overheating, these are the steps I took since Monday up to this evening:
1) Flushed radiator and replaced thermostat.
2) Replaced Coolant Sensor.
3) Replaced the cap.
4) Bled the system as decribed.
5) Checked the fuses and relays, all are working and approx 75 ohm showing between 2 of the connectors.
I saw the large black fan on the driver's side come on so I know that one is working. I did not see the other...did not get a chance, and I do not know which is the high and which is the low.
After all that, I thought it was fine. I then turned it on and left it on for approximately 30 minutes. The temperature gauge went right up to H again. When I turned it off, everything spills from the overflow...and you can imagine the steam, looks like the car is on fire.
The last thing about the overheating is that if I am on the highway, the temperature is beautiful, always in the middle. If I go for short rides, no problem either. However if stuck in traffic, like today, it started going up, I was able to survive by putting the heater way up (a day when we still needed a/c!)...but even then I had to stop the car at one point for a good 15 minutes. When I leave it on, not moving to test it, well it shoots right up as well and the high idling does not help of course getting it there quciker.
What remains to be changed? Could the water pump be a cause? It is not leaking or making any noise at all. Any other components besides the radiator itself, which looks fairly new by the way?
Thank you again for your time...I have to tell you this is really scaring me, I paid $2,300 for the vehicle on Sunday. I have no warranty whatsoever (my fault). Today is only Wednesday and I am up to $170 in parts and coolant leaking on the floor since Monday. Not to mention that I haven't gotten to enjoy this otherwise beautiful car.
Have a nice evening,
John
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Followup To
Question -
Hi,
I'm also an expert here on the network in the computer networking section. I think I wrote to to you once before.
I actually have 2 questions but let me give you the info I have first on the vehicle.
I purchase a Chrysler Intrepid 1997 3.5L fully equipped, just this Sunday. It has 122000 miles on it and it really looks brand new. I pulled what I could from carfax and locally. Clean records, 1 owner always going to dealer for checkups, etc... I have 2 small problems with it...I purchased the haynes manual and wondering if these 2 problems might have to influence on one another from what I am reading.
1) When in the park position it idles high, around 2 and sometimes a touch more. However when I put it in drive or reverse, the needle drops to 1 and idles normal and sounds good.
2) I put the AC on on Monday, it worked fined but some very light clear smoke was coming out of it. When I stopped. The coolant overflow leak out...allot of it. My first thought was that the thermostat is defective. I flushed out the rad yesterday, changed the thermostat and refilled and bled the system as per the book.
The heat gauge seems fine, no over heating. However it seems to be boiling hot around the engine...more than usual. The hose going to the thermostat housing seems pretty hard compared to my other vehicles but I don't know if that is normal. The check engine light is on as well.
The book says that if the coolant sensor, next to the idle sensor is damaged it will throw off all of the fuel injection system? So I am wondering if this maybe the cause to both problems.
Sorry for the lenght of this email but I really hope you can help as I feared making a bad purchase and I have no warranty.
Thank you in advance for your help. It is really appreciated.
Have a nice day,
John
Answer -
Hi John,
The best thing to do would be to try and get the fault codes that the engine controller must have stored in its memory (as described on page 7 of section 6 of the Haynes) because that is synonymous with the check engine light being on.
The most useful thing to do would be to try to get the fault codes that may stored in the engine controller memory to readout. Try using the ignition key: turn it "on-off-on-off-on" and leave it "on" (doing this quickly, no longer than 5 seconds). By "on" I mean just the normal position when the engine is running, not the cranking position. The 'check engine'light will remain on when you leave the key in the "on" position with the engine still not running. But then watch the 'check engine' light to begin flashing, then pause, flashing, pause, etc. Count the number of flashes before each pause and keep track of the numbers. Repeat the readout and verify the counts are correct. Then group them in pairs in the order that they came out, thus forming two digit numbers. You may notice that the pause is shorter between the digits of a given number, and longer between the numbers themselves. Then send me a 'follow-up' question telling me the results of your readout. By the way, 55 will be the last number (two groups of 5 flashes each) and that is the code for "end of readout".
I have the troubleshooting manual for several engines and we can look up the possibilities of what is wrong based upon what fault codes you show. There is also an essay on fault codes at the site:
http://www.allpar.com/fix/codes.html
which gives the meaning of the code numbers. But then you need to get specific info for what exactly might be the diagnostic tests or parts to replace to complete the repair.
If this approach doesn't produce fault codes at all, not even a 55, then you will have to go to a good tune-up shop where they have a more sophisticated code reader in order see if there are any codes. You should be able to get a readout for under $50. (That would be the case if the OBD-II system was adopted in '97 which sometimes results in less accessibility via the ignition key approach. But you won't know until you try it.)
The high idle speed may be addressed by the fault code. Otherwise a vacuum leak of any sort related to a hose or device that is connected to the intake manifold not being air tight will often be compensated for by the controller raising the fuel input and that causes an increased idle speed. So use the underhood sticker that shows all the vacuum-related lines, trace each line looking for a cracked hose or loose fitting to see if you can eliminate a leak.
On the temp issue, the cooling fans should come on at around 200F, and if they don't or if they don't come on immediately when you energize the ac system (even if the engine is cold) then there is something amiss with the fan system. See if they are working or not.
Yes, the coolant temp sensor controls the mixture and the fans. Check the resistance across its terminal, again as described in the Haynes (6-12).
Then write back with the results.
Roland
AnswerHi John,
All that remains to test are the water flow from the water pump, the flow through the radiator, and whether both fans work. Another possibility is that there is an internal leak in the engine due to a head gasket leak, but set the aside for the moment.
If the radiator filler neck is directly above the fluid inside the radiator so that you can see it when you look in the opening with a flashlight, then you can start the engine and let it start warming up and observe whether the fluid seems to be flowing or not. Also, if the heat came from the cabin heater core quite easily when used it to improve the cooling of the system that would establish that the fluid is indeed being moved by the pump.
If you look at the radiator and you see that the inlet and outlet hoses are on opposite sides, then feel whether the two hoses are indeed warm once the engine temp gets to mid-scale or more. If the flow across the radiator is open then the radiator will be hot on one side and noticeably warm on the other side, but there will be some temperature differential. If the flow is impeded by corrosion, then the outlet side will be quite surprisingly cool compared to the inlet side. I can't give you a temperature differential but if the outlet side is not really warm then it suggests that the coolant is not crossing the radiator effectively and thus not returning to the engine.
When the temp gauge is approaching full scale then both fans should come on, so check that out. Also I believe that both fans should come on when the a/c is selected. If only one fan comes on, then you can try jumping 12V from the battery to the disconnect for that fan to verify that it is functional and if it is then try exchanging the two fan relays to see if the other fan works and the originally working one now doesn't which would indicate a bad fan relay.
The possibility of a head gasket leak can be ascertained by the presence of water vapor coming out the tail pipe that has the odor of coolant in it. So watch the exhaust pipe when you start the car for the production of white smoke that lasts for more than say a minute which is the amount of time to exhaust any normal condensation in the exhaust system pipes.
So let me know if any of these possibilities looks to be present. Other than those, you may need to get a recommendation on a good radiator/cooling system repair shop. This is not a condition/situation that is unknown, so one of the possible causes can be determined. They also can check for exhaust gases in the radiator which would be a sign of a head gasket leak.
I assume too that you have a 50/50 mixture of antifreeze and water.
You are correct on the 12,24,55 readout. Before you buy a new idle speed motor, check the wires nearby to it that suppyy it (four wires involved) to make sure that the wires don't have compromised insulation due to being overheated which could have shorted one or more of them together. There are some tests you can do on the circuitry, but if the wires look o.k. then the motor is probably bad. You can check the motor by noting that it consists of two seperate coils, thus two pairs of leads that will read about 50 ohms between the ends of each coil, and will be infinite ohms if the 2 coils are indeed isolated from oneanother.
Let me know if any of these possibilities turn out to be the causes.
Roland
