QuestionQUESTION: I have a 2004 Dodge Durango with a Generation II Hemi. It has roughly 117000 miles on it. Since I bought it last year I have had to put a new starter and battery in it. I haven't had any other issues. I parked it one night, went the next day and it wouldn't turn. There is one click. and that's it. All gauges work. The PRNDL has all boxes around each letter, the check engine light flashes at me 10 times, however when I plug the computer up to it I do not get any codes? The battery and starter has been checked. all is well. Fuses and wires have been checked - All good....I am stumped....what can this be?
ANSWER: Hi Douglas,
Does the click that you hear come from the starter relay or from the starter solenoid itself on the starter motor? The relay is a quiet click the solenoid is a loud click.
The PRNDL all being "on" is an indication that the range switch position (located in the transmission) is either not connected properly to the transmission control module, or the TCM is not connected to the powertrain control module, or the pcm is not connected to the cluster.
When I say not connected, I mean that the digital communication bus is not transmitting the appropriate information on to the next module in the communication link up, or possibly the issue is even the display/cluster itself.
However the fact that you get a click when you try the starter shows that the pcm does know that you are in P or N or it wouldn't do such a click. So maybe the issue is rather that the system does know it is safe to actuate the starter, has allowed the relay to close (and maybe too the starter solenoid if a loud click) but the starter itself isn't being activated. That could be the starter solenoid switch or its connecting wire to the relay, or the battery's fat red wire connection to the starter motor. You say that the battery and starter have been checked, does that mean that if you jump 12v directly to the starter solenoid that the starter will crank the engine or not?
The check engine light flashing 10 times might be 5 flashes-pause-5 flashes which is the earlier OBD-I system code for "end of readout, e.g. no codes; but I am surprised that would be appropriate for an '04 model as OBD-I went out of use in '96.
So those are my thoughts at this point. Let me know the answers to my questions.
Please read the PS (below) and respond to it.
Thanks,
Roland
---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------
QUESTION: Hi Douglas,
Does the click that you hear come from the starter relay or from the starter solenoid itself on the starter motor? The relay is a quiet click the solenoid is a loud click.
The PRNDL all being "on" is an indication that the range switch position (located in the transmission) is either not connected properly to the transmission control module, or the TCM is not connected to the powertrain control module, or the pcm is not connected to the cluster.
When I say not connected, I mean that the digital communication bus is not transmitting the appropriate information on to the next module in the communication link up, or possibly the issue is even the display/cluster itself.
However the fact that you get a click when you try the starter shows that the pcm does know that you are in P or N or it wouldn't do such a click. So maybe the issue is rather that the system does know it is safe to actuate the starter, has allowed the relay to close (and maybe too the starter solenoid if a loud click) but the starter itself isn't being activated. That could be the starter solenoid switch or its connecting wire to the relay, or the battery's fat red wire connection to the starter motor. You say that the battery and starter have been checked, does that mean that if you jump 12v directly to the starter solenoid that the starter will crank the engine or not?
The check engine light flashing 10 times might be 5 flashes-pause-5 flashes which is the earlier OBD-I system code for "end of readout, e.g. no codes; but I am surprised that would be appropriate for an '04 model as OBD-I went out of use in '96.
So those are my thoughts at this point. Let me know the answers to my questions.
Please read the PS (below) and respond to it.
Thanks,
Roland
To:Roland…
I will be more technical. The starter is fine. I first panicked and thought I had a bad rebuilt starter and replaced it – again (less than 30 days old). Its been triple checked by me and the store. Since installing it again - I have checked the voltage from the battery to the starter – neg – positive, and even at one point made a manual ignition wire and turned it over that way… still all I got was the starter trying its best to turn the engine over, it tries harder, and the fan will actually turn about a quarter turn this way (End result – a click, then a rurrrr with a weak try at a turn), but still it doesn’t explain the fact that all PRNDL lights have squares around it.
I have also read where this issue has happened because of a bad ground from the battery to the engine block, so i ran a test there as well and nothing changed.
Also – In the testing, I have moved the gears to each letter by counting the slides. The Durango knows it can try and start in “P” and “N” but will not try and start in any of the others. Here is a interesting note that I am not sure about……while doing this I also noted that the car will roll like it is in neutral, while it is in “R” or “D or 1 or 2” is that normal?
As for the engine light flashing. It is OBOII compliant. I just noticed it flashed ALLOTT so I counted. It was a 10 count. Didn’t know if it had a meaning. AS for my meaning when I said it didn’t through any codes when I hooked it up to the computer…….I meant my software system OBOII. I use OBDlinkSX.
So now back to my question. Why did it all the sudden go from running and starting fine. To this? And how do I fix it?
AnswerHi Douglas,
I don't believe that the cluster being all lit up would impact the starter motor function.
The starter motor poor function is the first thing to address. It sounds to me like there is perhaps some sort of a mechanical blockage of the rotation of the engine. Have you tried to rotate the engine by hand using a socket and breaker bar on the crankshaft pulley bolt? See if that may be why the starter won't rotate it further than 1/4 turn. You might have a head gasket leak that has let coolant into a cylinder and that is causing a hydrostatic lock up of the engine.
The vehicle will normally 'roll' in all the gear positions other than park, so that is not the problem.
Please do another rating and consider a "yes" for a nomination of me for 'volunteer of the month.
Thanks,
Roland
