QuestionQUESTION: Hi Roland,
My brother has his voyager that refuse to start with the alarm set on (the use to start and die right after, but after three times it refuse to crank) .
I tried to use your diagnostic method that you gave in a previous answer :
"A diagnostic mode is available in the system to verify operation of all monitored switches or circuits. To enter diagnostics, cycle the ignition key to the accessory position 3 times, leaving the key in this position.
Upon entering diagnostics, the park and tail lamps will begin flashing to verify their operation. In addition, the horn will sound twice to indicate that the trunk key cylinder is in its proper position. Returning the ignition to the OFF position will stop the lamps from flashing while keeping the system in diagnostics.
While in diagnostics mode, a horn pulse should occur at each of the following events indicating proper operation:
(1) Beginning with all doors closed, open then close each door. The horn will sound when the door ajar switch closes, and then again when the switch opens. There must be a 1 second delay between closing and opening the switch.
(2) Open, then close the hood. The horn will sound when the hood is opened, and again when it is closed.
(3) Activate the power door locks in both the lock and unlock directions. The horn will sound after each activation.
(4) Rotate the key in each of the door lock cylinders to the unlock position. The horn will sound as the switch closes, and again when it opens. There must be a 1 second delay between changing switch states, or the horn will not sound.
(5) Cycle the key to the ignition RUN position. A single horn pulse will indicate proper operation of the ignition input. This will also take the module out of diagnostics mode. For any of these tests, if the switch does not remain open or closed for at least 1 second, the horn will only sound once.
The lack of a horn pulse, during any operation, indicates a switch failure, the lack of that input in the Vehicle Theft Security system module, or a failure internal to the module. Check for continuity at the switch, if this is good, check for an open or shorted wire between the switch and the alarm module. This self-diagnostic test may reveal component failure that is preventing the disarming, and once you correct that, you should be able to disarm the system. "
I tried this method but it doesn't work on the voyager.
is there the same kind of method to diagnose the system ?
excuse me for my language, I'm french.
Thanks,
Jerome
ANSWER: Bon Apres-Midi, Jerome (practicing about all I remember of high school and college French studies, 50+ years ago):
Does the vehicle have the ignition key 'handle' with a bulge for a 'chip' in it, and with the accompanying circular ring around the ignition key hole? That is called a sentry-key module.
I have been working this week with "Kris" who has the '00 model with that additional feature and in his case after he checked out what I will list below he told me that he did have that sort of a system, so I then suggested what to look for in that. You will find the 3 questions/answers we have exchanged so far in the list of previously answered questions on my home page at Allexperts.
Setting aside that sentry-key possibility, here is what I wrote to Kris,
"Likely it is the case that the wires from the key cylinder switch or interior power door lock switch on both front doors has become fatigued and 'opened'. (Did your brother try to lock/unlock the passenger door using the door key, just in case the wiring from that door is OK?) Other than searching through the flex point of the harness at both hinge areas, finding the wires, and reconnecting the two halves, the other approach would be to fake the body computer with a specific resistors touched to ground from one of the two wires found at the pins at the body control module to which the wires connect. Once you have done that you will have disarmed the theft system.
The trick in the future is then to NEVER use the power door lock buttons, the door key locks, or the remote (which you don't have) as you leave the vehicle so as to avoid arming the system once again. There is no way to easily detach the system as it is a part of the body computer.
The wires in question are from the left side a white/dark green wire to pin 45 of the plug that has pins 41 to 80, and a white/light green to pin 55 of the same plug from the right door. The body computer is under the dash, attached to the back side of the fuse box located on the left side accessible after you remove the under panel and the knee blocker of the dash.
The plugs are on the lower end of the body computer so you don't have to remove it. Just look carefully at the numbering on the two plugs.
To simulate the locking function you would take a 1,500 ohm resistor and touch one end to pin 45 (or 55) and then the other end to a ground (any shiny metal chassis part nearby or to the black/light green wire on pin 10 or 14 of the other plug at the bcm). Of course you want to not remove the plugs from the bcm when you do this action. The pins are numbered on the plugs if you look carefully where each wire enters the plug. Then remove the resistor. Access the wires by removing a slight bit of insulation or stick a fine straight pin into the wire to contact the inner conductor. Then simulate the unlocking of the door by using a 665 ohm resistor in a similar manner. That should disarm the system and allow you to start the engine successfully.
Then do not lock the car up by any other means than using the simple mechanical push bottons on the inside of the doors as you exit. The resistors don't have to be exactly these values but should be close to those ohm numbers. They are available at an electronics parts store.
You are thus simulating the locking/unlocking or either front door which is exactly what one does when he secures the vehicle and then returns when using the fob, the power door lock, or the door key lock."
The diagnostic method that you were so kind to remind me about does not apply to a vehicle as new as the '98. It may have never been of that type at all in the minivans. That one was used in the New Yorker/Fifth Avenue Sedans of the early '90's so that is why there was no respons to your attempt.
Do try the resistor jump technique, unless you also have the sentry-key system in which case look at the second q/a I had with Kris about what might be wrong with that part which would also cause the refusal to run that your brother is experiencing.
Your english is excellent!
Roland
---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------
g200 ground
QUESTION: Hi,
My brother forgot to tell me that the fuel gauge, the odometer and the prndl control doesn't work. So I'm thinking that the G200 ground connector inside the dash (i don't know exactly where) is the source of the issue, it is common with the sentry key immobilizer.
Did you ear about this kind of problem on a car before ?
Thanks for your fast answer.
AnswerHi Jerome,
G200 ground is on the 'center support of the instrument panel'...I would picture that as a vertical metal structural piece about midline of the body, but I can look further if you don't find it. There are clearly several wires going to the ground fixture. That is the general ground for all the cluster functions, but give it a try. Are those the only items that don't work on the cluster? Almost everything the cluster does is due to digital data that comes in on at twisted pair of wires on the cluster plug pins 9 and 10 but the ones that are not working are indeed shown in a group all on the same page but there are several similar pages for other parts of the cluster detail. There is perhaps some common aspect because they are pictured together but it may be a 'detail' in the 'trace' structure of the cluster. It doesn't appear to be an issue with separate hard-wiring as such.
How about the sentry-key possibility?
Roland
PS Thanks for the nomination and kind remarks.
